1977 J10 Honcho "Magnum"

[ColoJeeper]

When I put the collector plates on my Dodge truck, I signed a paper saying that I wouldn't drive it more than 4000 miles a year. The plates are 5 year renewable, but still fall under the emission testing every two years.

[Jim]

ColoJeeper previously posted:

[ColoJeeper]

I may be wrong about the emission part of this, as I can't find anything in writing to support this, though I am sure it is what they told me in the office when I picked up the plates. They give you a 5 year sticker to put on the plates. Guess I will find out fairly soon if they send me something inquiring about a emission test as I am about two years into having collector plates on this truck.

[FINOCJ]

For my 1970 (which falls in the all inclusive 1975 or earlier vehicles), the plate comes with a sticker for 5 years, no emissions needed. When renewed after 5 years, its another 5 year sticker, no emission necessary. The 1958 that I did last year also was one time registration without emission for 5 years. I think it gets a bit more complicated when you get into some of the later 70 and early 80 vehicles that got registered with collector plates at some point before changes were made to the law....This is where the 'grandfathered' in type rules come into play as long as the vehicle stays with same owner, and/or emissions testing etc....

[TyTheJeepGuy]

The two years that I was referencing was under one of the potential "loopholes" that I was going to shoot for to get it registered. For the normal case it is 5 years between emissions.

[TyTheJeepGuy]

I had started talking with my manager (Kevin, he came along for Kelly Flats so some of you may know him) about the Honcho, and he told me his friend is great at making his own bumpers. I got to check out some of his friend Lee's work and I was really impressed. So given that I am not a fan of the snowplow "bumper," I decided to ask him to make me a custom one.

He is also going to take the work I did with the rear bumper and finish it out correctly, by replace rusted out sections with new steel plate, and attempting to get the bend out of it. So I can keep that cool original looking rear bumper.

Check out his work in these photos:

[Java]

That looks awesome, simple and functional. Nice lines on it too.

[derf]

I may want to talk to your guy about building a custom bumper for my Comanche. Something similar in the lines is what I'd like, along with a Warn 8274 winch mount, which is way different than standard winch mounts.

[TyTheJeepGuy]

Well his work is good and I think he likes doing it. I'll run it by him. Also on his JK he has some really cool rock sliders for his differentials. Has me thinking for my Wrangler

[TyTheJeepGuy]

Update for the Honcho Magnum:

After resolving myself to having to pass emissions I started collecting a bunch of parts to recreate the systems that were taken off. I found that the Haynes manual really wasn't helpful for me, of course they're assuming that 100% of the system is sitting right there and you just have to swap out one piece. Recreating it from scratch is a whole other deal. I found the diagrams from the Technical Service Manual specific for the ol Honcho's year was the best resource, those are on oljeep.com.

I'm starting with probably the hardest, which is the AIR Guard system. Here is a diagram from the TSM:



Team Grand Wagoneer is a website that I found to be basically the only place to get the components for this in good shape, short of hunting around junkyards. I have nothing against the junkyards I just would rather be sure of what I'm getting than make a trip out and have it be a bust.

I had a lot of the components ordered months ago and sitting in my garage, but I got distracted by first building a snowbike, then selling it when it wasn't for me and buying a snowmobile, then smacking the front of said snowmobile into a tree and having to replace its bumper.

My brother visited and we gave the J10 a couple of shake down runs to get lumber for a gate project and it did great, so with some confidence I even drove it to Conifer and back to help Andy out a little bit with his Jeep build. So I decided it was about time I pulled mine into my garage for some work. I found that I was lacking a lot, so I'm still waiting on more orders to come in from Team Grand Wagoneer, and even some from Ebay. I feel a lot better about understanding the system now though so I think with the right parts, I should be able to hook it all up. The hardest part I believe will be mounting the air pump and getting a belt to it, since there is an aftermarket distributor that is huge and I think a custom bracket for the PS pump, which is what the bracket for the Air pump is attached to. I might need to see if I can get someplace to fab a solution for me if it doesn't work out, fingers crossed.

[TyTheJeepGuy]

I have a rare bit of good news concerning getting the unfun emissions "build" completed, it may have just turned fun!

I finally collected all of the (very expensive) components as I mentioned before for getting the "AIR Guard" system installed, went to try and mount the air pump and immediately broke the head off of a brand new bolt, right behind the power steering pump pulley so that extraction would be a big pain. I had seen a few smog/air pumps while searching for mine that were electric instead of belt-driven, and decided to call a Colorado emissions tech to confirm that would pass before investing in that route. Here's where the good news comes in, the tech shot down the electric pump idea, but then suggested that there is a special EFI system that would both give me the obvious benefits of EFI and no need for that complex Air Guard system! An EFI system was desirable but I held off on trying to go for something like that since it wouldn't be worth much to me if I couldn't get the thing re-registered.

I set up an appointment with the tech for Friday morning to get a more thorough overview of everything I'll need to pass emissions and finally get this truck not feeling like a pipe dream. This is awesome because up to this point I feel like I've just been stumbling along without much hope for getting it to pass.

[TyTheJeepGuy]

Well it couldn't all be good news of course, but I'll take "bad" information over non-information. Emissions tech today told me that the intake manifold that my Dad had installed on the engine was not EGR-compliant, which is an emissions system I will still need to have setup. What is currently on there is an Edelbrock Performer series but non-EGR. They make an EGR version and everyone is out of stock, I suppose because of Covid. I have one on backorder but might not be til July, and I can't install the EFI conversion until the new intake is on.

But at least now I have my heading and a resource in the form of that emissions tech so I'm still ahead of where I was on getting this truck back to life.

[TyTheJeepGuy]

I had the EFI kit come in but the pandemic has apparently stopped up production of intake manifolds for AMC V8s that are EGR-compliant. What I currently have on the ol Honcho Magnum is an Edelbrock Performer series, non-EGR. I have the same thing but with EGR backordered that should hopefully ship from the manufacturer by the end of this month.


In the meantime, there's a good deal of work that can be done short of actually installing the new throttle body to a new EGR-compliant intake manifold. I called Andy up (here's his WK build thread: https://www.frontrange4x4.com/forums...8259-Andy-s-WK) for some help and we spent a good portion of a Sunday getting this project under way. I think we both were excited at the thought of firing up this big engine eventually with electronic fuel injection!

By the end of the day, we had removed the carb from the intake manifold, removed the old main fuel line (and a vestigial line leftover from when the auxiliary fuel tank was in use), and located a new (included with the EFI kit!) fuel hose. We were about to mount the new fuel pump to the frame but either the kit didn't come with a nut and bolt for that or I lost it somehow, and I didn't have anything quite that size in the garage. The good news is the hole in the frame and bracket are ready to go once I make a quick stop at an Ace hardware.

Andy removed the manual fuel pump and installed the provided block plate and gasket. He also removed the AIR system air injection piping from the exhaust manifolds. Where we're going we have no need for such things.

There's a lot more to go but I'm glad Andy was there for the first day to have another brain to bounce things off of before tearing into the old truck.

Here's the emissions-compliant EFI kit I'm installing. So far I am very impressed with how this was put together and the instructions are great:
https://howellefi.com/product/tbi-ki...issions-legal/

And links to the installation instructions to get an idea of what the project entails:
https://howellefi.com/wp-content/upl...-1972-1993.pdf

I think the next thing I'll do after mounting the fuel pump is cutting a hole in the exhaust to mount the provided O2 sensor. The kit comes with a bung to weld in but I bought a clamp-on bung instead.

[FINOCJ]

TBI - Nice! If I ever get the sbc350 running in the 58 and decide to keep it, it may very well go TBI. Dealing with the fuel pump and higher pressure fuel lines is one the biggest hassles I think - looks like you are probably going with a frame mounted electric pump back near the tank? How are you handling the fuel line? hard line or braided line with AN fittings?
Would love to know more about removing/plugging? the air injection system on the exhaust manifolds - good luck!

[Jim]

You will enjoy the EFI setup!

Has anyone mentioned external fuel pump heat / overheating? Perhaps it's not a thing - I only have one comment saying it is an issue... My MPFI conversion uses an inside the tank pump (and I can help if you wish to relocate to in-tank). The guy (Parker Co area) that James found for the my rear steel trunk had a jeep with a V8 conversion with an external, frame mounted fuel pump. He commented on having overheat issues (vapor lock?).

[TyTheJeepGuy]

Thanks James.

Obviously I don't have this system up and running yet to truly confirm, but according to Howell the fuel pressure is indeed higher than what the manual pump setup was creating but it is still pretty mild. A quote from the installation instructions:
"Since the TBI system operates on only 12PSI fuel pressure, it is not necessary to have high-pressure hose, or aircraft type threaded connections."
The hose they supplied is 5/16" fuel hose and worm gear clamps. When I was researching Holley EFI kits I was also concerned about the new fuel lines that would be needed; this kit seems to have simplified that quite a bit. The fuel pump is only 13 bucks from Howell which is awesome. I like that this kit is pretty much an EFI system designed for a GM truck that they just adapted for Jeeps with AMC V8s. Most of the components, including the ECU, have listed part numbers and are still available. There's also a "limp home mode" that sounds reassuring.

The air injection manifold holes are plugged with 9/16-18 bolts, the instructions helpfully included this info in their "Removal of non-required parts" section. This part was easy for me, because the air injection pipes are brand new and installed by me. I ordered the crazy expensive bolts with air injection holes in them but never installed them, I just had mocked up the air injection pipes to the manifolds using the bolts that were already blocking those ports. I'll have a pretty sizeable Craigslist ad after this is all over.

[TyTheJeepGuy]

Thanks Jim, more than just not having to maintain a 70s era emissions system, there'll be more average power and more importantly, I'll be able to enjoy this both around town and at 10,000 ft for some stellar camping trips!

I have not heard of the overheating, but I am doing exactly that: frame-mounted external pump. So maybe I should just order a spare 13 dollar pump and keep it in the recovery bag, and then if I have a problem with overheating I could start looking into that relocation. At that point I will definitely be looking for some help with the in-tank solution.

[TyTheJeepGuy]

Attached is a photo of the now-unnecessary brand-new air injection pipes. On the top was a one-way valve (not pictured, which I also have and won't need ) that would keep the exhaust air from getting into the AIR Guard system. (smog air pump system)

[Jim]

TyTheJeepGuy previously posted:

[FINOCJ]

Jim previously posted: