IFS question

[Backcountryislife]

Ok, for all of you NOT running a SA, are you running disconnects on the front?

I've got an H3, and I run with some folks with pretty built rigs... but NONE of them have the front disconnected.

I talk to FJ guys, and they're unhooked, with what sounds like no issues... why not the H3?

I seem to get a lot of "you'll break stuff" from the H3 crowd, but you can buy rcv 1/2shafts which are guaranteed... so heck, I almost WANT to snap them so I don't have to worry about it anymore!

The rear flex on this thing is pretty good (even connected), but the front is pitiful... I've gotta do something.

Any of you chevy IFS guys know why we shouldn't do it, or is this just something they're worried about without good reason?

[Chris]

I assume you're talking about the front sway bar, if that's right I'll just say that I removed mine totally with no negative results. I don't do freeway exit ramps at 50 though. ;)

[Backcountryislife]

I assume you're talking about the front sway bar, if that's right I'll just say that I removed mine totally with no negative results. I don't do freeway exit ramps at 50 though. ;)

On a 4 runner I assume?

Yeah, meaning front sway bar. I know it's not suddenly going to be amazing in the travel dept... but it's plain pitiful right now, so anything will help!! I'm torsion lifted as it is, so there's already down angle on the shaft, so if I get more up travel it's going to be mostly positive, down travel I'd think should be a situation where less load would be on the wheel, so less likely to snap anything there I'd think.

[Chris]

Yes, the 4Runner. I suggest disconnecting it and giving it a try which is what I did before heading to Moab one year. I removed it since it was easier than disconnecting and keeping it secure and never put it back on.

[Backcountryislife]

Yeah, keeping the bar on there will be a little challenge, but I can fab some climbing webbing to hold them somehow. My wife drives it from Dumont to Gtown most days, so at I-70 speeds I want to have it on there.

I just have some concern about why the yota guys are all ok, but NOBODY does it on this thing... is there a big difference in the diff/ cv's on this compared to yours?

[Chris]

I can't answer that but I should add that I also have stiffer springs than stock and that people with stock springs don't like the added sway.

[Fordguy77]

I run Quick Discos on my GFs Explorer, and my Ranger, the only 2 "off road" rigs I have with ifs, and have had no issues. Its a pretty popular mod for Ranger Based Vehicles, and there is no real negitive feed back on any of it. I have no info on the hummers thou.

Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using Tapatalk 2

[Backcountryislife]

The H3 front diff is just an AAM I believe, same one that's in the Colorado. Lifted with the torsion bars the way I am, I'm in a downtravel position as I sit, I feel like I could use more uptravel without even being any more risky than I am right now... just seems like people are scared to do it on this vehicle. I know the aluminum diff isn't exactly confidence inspiring, not sure if angles are increasing risk to the diff, but that can be upgraded to a steel one they use on the V8 version of the H3.

[ctracy5]

The Best advice I can give is that all vehicle are different, just because it works on a yoda does not mean it will work on a GM, Isuzu is a good example, at all of the sites and forms I visit no one ever talks about busted CVs or other axle issue that are common with other lifted IFS, the main issue lifting (at least with older Isuzu) are the tie rods and other steering issues but luckily several different companies make beefy after market ones. Most knowledge about 4x4ing can cross between different rigs but sometimes each rig has weird things that are only on that brand, and sometimes only that model.

from what everyone else has said and the fact that you need it to still drive down the highway I think some type of quick disconnect would be your best option. After I get my lift I am going to look into doing something like this on my trooper. Sounds like you are already talking to some other H3 guys so I would find (if you already haven't) find a hummer or even better an H3 specific form and ask around. I love the guys on here there is years of experience with basically any rig you can think of here but I am still on several Isuzu specific forms if I have some very trooper specific questions.

[Backcountryislife]

I'm on a hummer specific forum, but the answers I get are vague... it's a bad idea, you'll break shafts... I was hoping to find some chevy folks who have similar equipment that could verify the reason for why, since I seem to be missing that part of it.

[Patrolman]

I have run Toyota's with the sway bar completely removed as well. No negative side effects. Personally, I would have a couple spare parts such as a CV handy just in case (and know how to replace them) and give it a whirl. Nothing worse than busting a CV and being stuck on the trail.

[Squshiee1]

I run my rodeo without a sway bar, i just took it off, i notice more roll but its not to bad. i did get about 4 more inches of upward travel and the car stays more straight at steeper angles.
The first thing that people said was that i would break my cv axles after 1 run... BS, i ran my cv's untill the boots ripped, then after about 1,000 miles or so i replaced them and i am still not having issues.
i say take it off, or run quick disconnects and flex it out in your drive way or at a shop, then see if your steering components or your suspension is hitting anything. I am also on torsion bars.

That is a pic with the sway bar removed, my suspension maxed out, the body is still fairly straight, before it would have made it half as far as i did and the body would have been at a much steeper angle.

[Brody]

What I think that I would do is to drive my Hummer to the nearest Yota dealer and compare the IFS set up with that on a newer 4Runner, Taco, or FJ Cruiser. IFS set ups are like comparing apple to oranges: they are both round...

Here is a link where they talk about doing sway bar disconnects on some GMC IFS rigs and some feedback.

http://www.pavementsucks.com/board/thread-IFS-flex-without-sway-bar-connected

I think Quigley 4x4 vans make an after market GMC conversion using an IFS with a disconnect and GMC parts.

What has been said: try it disconnected. What I would do first is to raise the front end off the ground with the sway bar connected and letting the tires hang down. Mark or photograph the axle angle. Cycle either tire up to the limit of it's travel and take another picture. Do the exact same thing with the sway bar disconnected. What you are interested in is going to be any binding due to the increased angle of the CV axle. If you have blocked the tires (always a good idea.....) you should be able to turn by hand either tire when it is hanging down or jammed up. Turn the wheels one way and then the other, both hanging and as high as they will go, too. This will pretty much tell you if you are going to have issues.

Personally, I can't see anything other than that that would cause any more or any less problems than on any other IFS rig. You will experience more body roll, lean when you go into corners, and maybe some nose diving when you brake. All of those are easily adapted to. Almost all of the folks that I know (excluding Jeeps) that have disconnected their sway bars, have simply ended up removing them as the driving difference is minor.

If the disconnected sway bar works for you and the GMC chassis, but you want to attach it for your wife or freeway driving, you can probably easily adapt any of the Jeep sway bar disconnects to work with the GMC. If you don't want to fool with adapting a ready made item, simply Google "home made sway bar disconnects:Jeeps" and you will find a lot of home brew setups that work fine.

Sorry that I didn't have a short answer. Hope this helps.

[95tacoma]

On the Tacoma I tried mine disconnected first, and realized that I would never hook it back up so I removed it. It leans, but I have stiffer springs front and rear now compared to when I first removed it. With the soft stock springs it would get a little scary on twisty two lane highways. If your wife drives it I would look into making some disconnects just to be safe, unless she is comfortable without the sway bar and how it handles. I used to drive two hours at 75 every other weekend and never noticed an adverse affect on the highway.

[Backcountryislife]

Ok, went out & sprayed the bolts with some PB... they're coming off on friday.

Not sure how to hang the bar at this point... but I'll figure it out.

[Andrew]

I'm running disconnects.

And what I mean by that is I broke my mount on my control arm so my sway bar is disconnected :lmao:

I also removed the rear sway bar soon after I got my truck too. It's useless really.

[Backcountryislife]

Well... this is kind of depressing if this is all there is to be had (take rear out of the equation & look at the front only)

http://i1191.photobucket.com/albums/z464/Pooter110/DSCF0028.jpg



Not exactly exciting... but it's better than what I've got now.

Somebody got a SA I can borrow for a few years???:D

[Squshiee1]

Thats awsome! That is quite a bit of flex for an ifs setup.

[Backcountryislife]

Thats awsome! That is quite a bit of flex for an ifs setup.

well... the rears on these things do pretty well, even connected (I see no need to disconnect the rear right now) but the front on that one looks to me to be only about 1' or less flex. I'll still take it :D, but looking at a few others I've seen, they seem to do better.

[Squshiee1]

you can always SAS!:D

[Backcountryislife]

you can always SAS!:D

Yeah... as much as I'd like that... If I'm going to go that far... I might as well just buy a J/k or get a dedicated rig.

The key with this thing is it's a starter rig for me, I will NOT dump a bunch of $$ into it. If I get much more serious about it (pretty much guaranteed) I'll likely just sell it, get an off road only rig, and buy my wife a car! (which I should have done here... but this thing is pretty fun, so I won't complain!)

[ctracy5]

Yeah... as much as I'd like that... If I'm going to go that far... I might as well just buy a J/k or get a dedicated rig.

I have been in that debate lately of how much time and money to put into this rig before I am just spinning my wheels and would be better off with getting a dedicated rig. These first gen troopers can become very capable machines with the right mods but my trooper is my daily driver at the moment so I can only sacrifice so much on road performance/safety to gain off-road capability.

[Squshiee1]

sounds like us 3 are in the same boat! make do with what we have!

[Backcountryislife]

I have been in that debate lately of how much time and money to put into this rig before I am just spinning my wheels and would be better off with getting a dedicated rig. These first gen troopers can become very capable machines with the right mods but my trooper is my daily driver at the moment so I can only sacrifice so much on road performance/safety to gain off-road capability.

For me... it's a daily kinda (17.3 mi/ day from dumont to G-town... pretty easy) but the issue is $$. If I mod the heck out of it... what is is worth?

It's always going to be what it is (a hummer, which is now owned by a Chinese company) and parts will just get harder to find... how much do you invest in a vehicle like that??? It's a surprisingly effective offroad rig in stock-ish form, but beyond that I just don't see a ton of investment being justified.

My next step is slapping on the shackles I've got sitting here & getting a locker, but I'm looking at just picking up a detroit or a lock right to keep the $$ down.

[ctracy5]

It's always going to be what it is (a hummer, which is now owned by a Chinese company)

Couldn't have said it better. I don't know much about the these hummers but if you are not seeing many people doing major mods to them and their is not a lot of available parts i think you have the right idea, mod it enough to have fun and do what you want but why throw money at. You said it is already a pretty capable rig so is it worth the time or the money if in the long run you are going to get something different anyways.

[Backcountryislife]

Yeah... it's funny, when I was looking I was planning on an FJ or an Xterra almost exclusively, drove a few, then drove the H3 after having my arm twisted by a buddy up in scummit at Hudson, and it really suprised me. GUTLESS as hell, but it just did very well stock in comparison.

There's some serious h3 rigs out there, I just don't see the higher end potential with it, compared to a JK. (a JK for this kind of $$ though would be hard to compare as is though... so all things are relative)

Pull limiters, add locker, add some more protection... and it'll do me for a while;)

[ctracy5]

yeah that is about where I am at. I want my lift, protection, lockers and some 33's or 35's and that is the plan for the trooper at the moment. But until that cash is there that is only a dream :lmao: .

[Backcountryislife]

Nicest thing about the H3... 35's go on for free... hard to bit** about that! I bought the thing & threw some procomps & treadwrights on it & had 35's for around $1k... then went to see how stupid I could look on spring creek right off the bat!!! I can do a small lift & go 37 which is tempting & leaves it where it's still sellable...

I know I'm going to keep deluding myself about "what's justifiable" for some time to come...:rolleyes:

[Brody]

I know I'm going to keep deluding myself about "what's justifiable" for some time to come...

Welcome to the wonderland of 4 wheeling and flat wallets....not to mention the justifying to any SO exactly "why" any upgrade is important. Hint for the latter : the word "safety" figures in at the top of the list for upgrade 'buzz words' for 4x4 play toys...

[Backcountryislife]

shoot... Wheelin is a joke compared to sleds.


We spend 20k on a sled, in 2 years it's trashed, and we break something nearly every weekend. oh yeah... insurance is more than for my cars, and then there's race gas... it hurts. THAT is why I'm too broke to wheel a real rig!!


most years the sled is my ride for 8+ months of the year... I've never even thought about putting it away before june before!




This is july 3 last year!!!
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/254889_1743829997628_1295088056_31519595_6531317_n .jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/263494_1843213962165_1295088056_31606366_4750375_n .jpg


boosted 2 strokes man... WAY more expensive than trucks...

[ctracy5]

That is sweet!!!!

[Backcountryislife]

That is sweet!!!!


It USUALLY is!!!


I did the math last year... I spend about 18k a year on sleds.


Of course, my wife rides too... and her taste in sleds is just as pricey as mine!!!


Abby:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/69833_1642472551521_1528073247_31554978_4569475_n. jpg


it's like a nice meth habit... but more expensive... :D

[ctracy5]

I would like to say and safer but I don't know :lmao:

[Backcountryislife]

Safer... oh heck no!!! But you're teeth will look better a few years into sledding than meth I'm pretty sure :D

[Brody]

Sweet sleds! Nice pictures!

[Squshiee1]

you should put a slick on the sled and then drag race it during the summer.

[Backcountryislife]

you should put a slick on the sled and then drag race it during the summer.



That would require me going to somewhere flat... not gonna happen!!! :p Also, the way we gear them for mountain riding, they'd do HORRIBLY in a drag race. I've got 250+ hp & about 490 lbs full of gas, and it's set up to top out at 90mph right now... take it down to 5000 feet & I'd just be exploding belts.

[ctracy5]

That sounds like fun, I worked with a guy from Minnesota so it was all about going fast said it hit about 135 on one.

[Backcountryislife]

I really wonder what mine would run down low with the right gearing... I can turn up the boost more, I just don't because of the cost of race gas (I mix 91 3:1 with 116 or run 50% av gas) I'd love to feel the yank it would have on asphalt & being 5000+ feet lower!

[ctracy5]

Growing up in Washington I have never been on one and have always thought they looked fun

[Backcountryislife]

THAT... is a crying shame. I could help fix that problem for you... :D

[ctracy5]

Maybe, but usually when snow is on the ground I am stuck doing homework, I ave lived in Fort Collins for 5 years and have only gone snow boarding twice, I used to get out at least 5 times a year in Washington.