Winch Troubleshooting

[Chris]

Yesterday when on Pole Hill I found out my winch doesn't work, fortunately everyone else had one so we were good. I need to get this working but am pretty ignorant about anything electrical. When I connect my remote to power it I just get a click. Where do I start? :confused:

[Max]

You can start by posting the make and model.

[Chris]

I guess that would help - Warn XD9000i :redface:

[Hypoid]

One at a time, remove each cable and clean the connection with a fine wire brush. Put each cable back before removing the next. ;)

[Chris]

Thanks Mike, that's within my skill set! I'll do that tomorrow.

[Fordguy77]

Every time I experience a clicking, it is almost always a grounding issue somewhere. Mikes idea is probably the best start to the wiring attack.

[Patrolman]

Yeah, probably a bad connection in the solenoid box, but can also be on the winch motor. It is a bit time consuming, but hope that fixes the problem.

[Jim]

Reinforcing two individual posts - clean connections (one at a time) and grounding - those covered my issues. I'm heading to north Denver Thursday about 10am to get the grinder stand from Sean. If you'd want me to jump down to your place for some wiring / wrenching, let me know, I'd be happy to.

[Chris]

Thanks guys, I'll try to get to it today.

Jim, depending on how things go before then I might take you up on your offer.

[Chris]

BTW, I Have an M8000, the other one I identified was my previous winch. :brody:

I cleaned all the connections and found the problem but it's not a connection to the battery, solenoid but to the winch motor. I could polish those connections to bright and shiny and it wouldn't help.

I found a trouble-shooting pic on jeepforum.com and my winch (now on the bench) failed. The F1 to A gives nothing and F2 to A gives a faint indication that it's trying.

Pete fixed either F1 or F2 when I bought the winch with a broken stud but I don't recall which one. In his first attempt it went south and he had to fix the connection close to the internals but the exact details are fuzzy. It follows that there would be where the problem exists. I wonder if the internal part (what's it called?) came loose and is now preventing the motor from turning. Since the test for forward and backward both fail I'm thinking he fixed F1 and IF my guessing is correct the "trying to turn" sound at F2 could be because it's now loose and jammed inside.

I'll quit guessing now. :lmao:

[Chris]

I wonder if the internal part (what's it called?) came loose and is now preventing the motor from turning.

Damn, answering my own question it appears the mystery part is not a replaceable part. See pic below.

The closest labeled part (46) is the whole assembly called "motor" at $200.00 :frown:

[Patrolman]

Is it just one of those studs that broke? Can you take it apart and just replace the stud? Might have to rig something up from another manufacturer or hardware store.

[Chris]

Yes, that's what Pete did but it's hard to find some sort of insulated piece with anything close to the right dimensions. He tried using what remained pieced together I think. As I recall it's stepped to keep in from going through the housing and keep the cable from contacting it too. Then the bolt goes through. I'm going to pull it apart to see but honestly have no idea what inside relating to the 3 connections or the two hex heads.

[Tom]

Chris,
Are there any motor rewinding shops in your area. If so they would likely have something that could be made to work or at least provide an idea.

[Hypoid]

I can take a look at it, if you like. :)

[Chris]

That would probably be the best idea Mike though Tom has a good idea too. Seeing as I have more time than money I might just take a stab at it myself.

[Hypoid]

F1 and F2 go to the windings:

http://www.frontrange4x4.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=15952&stc=1&d=1290759980
http://www.frontrange4x4.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16010&stc=1&d=1291276047

The "A" goes to the armature:

http://www.frontrange4x4.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=15775&stc=1&d=1289757775

[Hypoid]

Remember to use two wrenches, and jam nuts to work on the studs...

http://www.frontrange4x4.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16030&stc=1&d=1291569750

http://www.frontrange4x4.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16031&stc=1&d=1291569750

http://www.frontrange4x4.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16032&stc=1&d=1291569750

[Chris]

The F1 & F2 look like mine, are what I call the "insulator" available that you know of? Is the internal connection pressure fit or soldered?

[Hypoid]

I don't know about the insulator, Chris. The internal connection is likely soldered.

[Jim]

Just holler if you'd like me to stop over!

Thumbs up to Mike for his wonderful pix - specifically the sequence showing jam nuts utilized to allow turning the main nut without turning the bolt and thus twisting & breaking the wiring inside.

Adding more on the internal connection: In Mike's post #17, the first picture, the bottom of the two bolts. You can see the head of the bolt with its connection to the field plate. The connection, commenting on soldering, is likely not an "electronics" solder connection that at least I am familiar with. Electronics soldering is fairly weak and made of a low temp solder such that a hot winching session could see the solder melting. I'd guess the connection is either of the stronger "silver solder" type or perhaps a tack weld (plate to bolt head).

Tom's comment of checking with a motor winding shop could be an inexpensive route - more so if you take the broken parts to them to see if they can either repair them or replace them from a "parts bin" of used parts. If it's the case where the stud has disconnected from the field winding plate, they might be able to quickly tack weld them together for a $5 coffee fund donation. You might also find Warn parts (used) via fleabay.

[Chris]

Remember to use two wrenches, and jam nuts to work on the studs...

That rings a bell, I think not doing that was the problem with the first repair that led to the harder one. Thanks Mike.

[Chris]

I think I found a local company that sells Warn motors for $83, waiting to hear from them. If they do I'll go that route and feel safer tearing into my broken one and learn a thing or two and hopefully end up with a spare.

Jim, obviously everything's undecided right now but you're always welcome to stop by. Barb would be happy to see you too!

[Jim]

oof - $83, while not a bad price, more do$h than a repair might cost (I'm recalling the more time than cash comment).

While spares are nice, it's not something you'd likely be doing trailside, thus, why bother having a spare at home. I'd lean towards repairing (& learning) vs. replacing (all depending upon cost).

If you're up for Thurs mid-day, I could stop down. PM me an address, all I have is "Aurora".

[Chris]

Yeah, that thought came to me after sending. Pm coming.

[Hypoid]

I'll find out where we (work) take our obsolete starters for repair.

Jim, we had a class project in 2010. Search "winch won't work" by Rob. We had a bit of banter, a little tech, and a lot of fun. :)

Chris, I wondered if you would remember that. ;)

[Chris]

I do now Mike, I'll take a look.

[Hypoid]

I'll find out where we (work) take our obsolete starters for repair.I asked at the toolbox meeting this morning.

We take our commercial business to A-1 B.A.S.E. in Commerce City, behind SAPP Bros. truck stop. http://a-1base.com/Home_Page.php

At the same time, a few people piped-up for D&D Auto Electric, in Wheat Ridge. If the guy at D&D took commercial accounts, he'd have our business.

D&D Auto Electric
10920 W 44th Ave, Wheat Ridge, CO 80033
(303) 423-6522

There is a bonus for driving to D&D, his next door neighbor is Four to Go (http://www.fourtogo.com/). :)

[Popsgarage]

There is a bonus for driving to D&D, his next door neighbor is Four to Go.

Recommended D&D. I'll keep that in mind!

[Chris]

Big thanks to Jim who stopped over today and found the problem. Short version: My suspicion was totally wrong and Pete's fix appears good though one brush was not making any contact. The brush holder was cockeyed and the brush was retracted. Jim disassembled, bent the bracket to allow for correct movement and after determining it was working correctly reassembled and put power to it and viola, it works!

Jim's also a good teacher as he explained stuff and didn't let me sit back and watch but had me do it, I know 90% more now than I did before he showed up so I thank him for that as well. My terminology may be lacking but i'm sure Jim can fill in the blanks.

Thanks Jim!

[Jim]

^^^ What he said! :thumb:


One of the four brushes was stuck, retracted, and not contacting the armature. Checking the housing the brush resides & slides in, the housing was bent which caused the brush to get cockeyed and stuck in the housing. We "re-formed the housing" (read: bent it back) so the brush could freely travel. Done.

Chris showed me how to run the winch motor while bypassing all solenoids - something that is good to know!

A good day.

[Tom]

That's awesome. KUDOOS.

[xaza]

Pictures!

[Jim]

I was out of my element today - not one photo was recorded - sorry.

[Hypoid]

Nice!!! :thumb:

[Patrolman]

Glad that it was a relatively easy fix. Also good to know you can tear into it trail-side if it came down to it!