Docs 04 TJ

[dieseldoc]

Ok all as I am about payed off on my jeep I am starting to amas my parts.
Pluss I am expecting to get my left over parts from taking my samuri apart.
So I will have parts to sell and some to use.

Got me a good hook up on my axle....?way silly price!
Front- Ford dana 44 w/ 4.88 an a lock right
Rear- Ford 9" w/ 4.88 and a spool


STUFF I HAVE:

I have a set of 5 maxxis creepy crwal 37"x12.50r16 abit more than half left on them.
Seat w/ hokes to fit 5 point belts.
hiem joinfs for high steer 4 with all hardwear.
48" high lift jack


The overvall plan is:
Full width axles
disk converted on rear
37" tires
100" wheel base
4 link triangulated rear ( no track bar)
3 link w/ track bar front
4" lift (unkown type yet)
2 speed gear drive transfer case ( stak or atlas)
hydro assisted cross over steering set
cage it inner or exo to yet be determuned ( leaning to inner)

[The StRanger]

Sounds like a good set up.

[Java]

Sounds like you've got a busy weekend coming up!! :thumb:

[dieseldoc]

Going to be a few weekends really. Lots of prep work to build the axles to be ready to put them in.
But as the strecth is much like the genright kit......18 hfs of book time for the install.....
Good thing I have access to plazma cuters and the like.....
Pics to come.

I am at present time building a new front bumper!

[Cr33p3r]

Doc, I can save you a few $ I have a brand new 4 link mounting bracket kit that I'm not going to be using. If interested PM me.

[dieseldoc]

So I have a new front bumper under construction.
My curant bummper has small provisions for lights.
They were intended for some small turn signals.
I am also changing the depth and hight of the thing.
Also accommodating some LED lights.


Whst I had.

[dieseldoc]

More pics will come once I can get them to up load.....

[dieseldoc]

So my parfs sjowed up from cali this week.....
I have a good start on what I need to build the jeep.
My tires and front coil overs are here and some miscellaneous links to cut up for the joints.

Seems all my pics are to dam big or something.....grrr!

Any how parts ar:

Tires-37x12.50r16 maxxis creepies
Front- fabtech 6" coil overs
Saets- checker specilas w/holes for 5 point harnesses.

[MultiScuf]

Can't wait too see the build :)

[dieseldoc]

tires and other parts are hear from cali finally!
we have 37" maxxis creepy
some fabtech 6" coil overs for the front and replacemnet seats
so the pics show what it could grow to but the front is foreward a bit of what I want
the new front coils
and what it is right now

[96EXXLTinCO]

Looking like it's gonna be a fun rig!!

[Rick]

if you could put the wheels where they are in the picture that would be sweeeet!!!!!! looking forward to the build.

[dieseldoc]

Ya its a bit forward but real with the way I am going to biuld it I could push it there if I want to.

The front I am goingto use the ford radius arms. Yet they will be modified to length and have a jonny joint on the frame end.
So realy I can put the front where ever as long as the steering works. Or I can graft in a astro bix to get the reveresed rotation.

[redneck23ms]

I like the look of the tire placement but those cool overs are going to be too short to be useful with a solid axle. You will need a 12" travel coil over to be of any use for a link type suspension. Could possibly get by with 10". I'm thinking about getting a set of 37 creepys as my next tire

[dieseldoc]

Theses are frome the 6" lift from fabtech.
They worked great on the rear of my Sami.

Alex I will messure them today but I think they Hve a 10"shaft.

Ypu will enjoy the performance from the creepy they work well.
Wear on the other hand if they are daily driver......20-30k miles and done.
I am thinking about a daily set to keep the investment in my offroad tires.
To replace these things is a bit out of control.

[redneck23ms]

My rig isn't my daily anymore as I have a f250 that I drive most days and a trailer. You can probably make 10" of travel work but will be limiting yourself a little. I use all of a 11" shock with leg springs.

[dieseldoc]

Ya. The front of that rig had 14" shocks on it.
I was realy looking at using what I have. As to keep cost down.
I dont realy want to be into the 6 plus of lift.
I want to keep it low to the ground.
The rear is going out board as with the wider axles I can do that.

[Brucker]

WooHoo!!! Custom fab! My favorite!

Hope to clarify things a bit for you. First off stop thinking about your components as 6" of lift. That only makes sense in the context that they were designed for, using all the components that came in the kit. You are only using some components (coilovers) from a lift. You should only care about length of travel, size of bore and shaft, valving, and spring rate. If these were used in the back of a Sami, then all those things mentioned may not work with being used in the front of a TJ. The front of the TJ probably weighs close to double what the rear of the Sami did. So just know that those things will probably need to be swapped out. IE- rebuilding/reconfigure each coilover.

Second, for length of travel, yes, the longer, the more travel you can get out of them. But it is about placement. Shock length doesn't dictate vehicle height. Shock placement does. It has been proven on many different builds that one can run a 14" travel shock without having to cut the hood and still achieve a belly height of sub 24" on tires lager than 37's. 16's usually have to have the hood cut. Now going shorter won't always limit your travel, but you will have to get creative. Like since you are wanting to use a link type setup of radius arms, you could build the arms to take the shocks. This moves the shock up the arm, thus requiring less shock travel to achieve more axle travel. Or you could look into building a cantilever setup. I personally am not the biggest fan as it adds extra weight and design and fab time, but heck, F1 folks have been doing it for years so that setup has it's advantages.

Third, axle placement. I am all for extending wheelbase. On the front, as you already stated, your limiting factor will be your steering. You can move the box quite a bit forward but again, check that first as it's the limiting factor. You could go to full hydro but since this will be daily driven (street driven) I would highly recommend against that as there is no mechanical backup and therefore would be illegal.

Hope that this helps and good luck with the project!

[dieseldoc]

Bruckner. We are on the same pages.
The coil overs are still valved and oils and psi for the TJ front end. All I changed was some springs.
I still have to correct springs.
I also have a line on some king coil overs 12" travel all ready set up for the front TJ as well 1000 for pair still in the box....
I will go hyrdo assested but as we both said the limiting factor is the sterring box.
Thus why I may go with the astro box. They are reversed so it will be behind the pitman arm...
Not sure yet how I want to do the front.
I have seen semi truck air bags used 8 inches back on the arms.....wow it worked so nice....and with 39's I was impressed.

[dieseldoc]

Did some more bummper work tonight.
I cut the hoop off of the bumper from my sami buggy
recut the length and agles to work on my new front bumper.
Added some supports to it and BAM done bumper....

[The StRanger]

Nice

[dieseldoc]

So after some very long concideration.
I hav decided to not cut up my wrangler.
With it being part of the last run of the TJ I am keeping fairly factory.
It will get a new belly pan from claton offroad.
A 2.5" lift and some better fenders found a good set of DIY flat front and rear.


The truggie will be built!
I am going to use all the part I have amassed already to build a DAKOTA.
The wrangler is a great rig but space is an issue.
The dakota space cad has better space in the front seats.
A V8 that once it gives up a HEMI will fit....
I have thought of building one of these for some time.
With them being a larger of the mid size trucks they realy are just right.
I am looking to use a quad cab truck bed to move the wheel well for the axle shift to get the wheel base to where I want it.
I would be ok with 108" but 113" is a bit longer than I want for the places we will take this.
I will do an exo cage with some tude work inside for the seat and harnesses.
Front and rear bumpers will be fabed and will tie into the cage and fender work.
Will shorten the back portion of the bed as well to keep the departure angles steep so in the 70* plus.
I have a supplier for a winch w/ synthetic rope. Xrc for 400.
I have a 4:1 teraflex T-case for this thing to get started with.
At a much lafer time I might do a 231 dubbler to an Atlas.
But that will be much later and only if realy needed.
Ford axles that I have w/radius arms still there so these will get a joony joint on the end if the angles will work right if not build them to be what is needed as there is not many after market suppliers for them.
The 4.7l v8 is a good start. Most likely will be a auto trans as the manual is very tough to find.
As I stated earlier once that gives up a hemi will find its way in there.
My maxxis 37' tell they wear out....who knows what set after that.
Wheels will be 16"steels if I deem bead locks to be nesisary then Staun internals will be the way to go. They give dual locks as they are from the inside.
I have a hydro boost box and pump for this set up as well. At this point the box has plugs and the ram will come as demed nesisary.
Hysteer will be there along with a selectable locker.
4.88's are present already. Am not oppossed to 5.13' s at a later time if needed.
I think the auto trans and v8 will be fine w/37's
I will be shooting for low spung yet tons of wheel travel.
I have a set of 10" travel fab tech coil overs and a set of 12" king coil overs.
I think these may get sold for some ORI struts so they can lay 8n next to the frame to allow for the cantilever to work.
Its a bit more work but 3:1 with a set of 12" travel struts will give 36" of travel.
My friands in saint george built the first cantilever moon buggie so I have assistance in the design work.
This thing will be keep street legal for road travel from trail to trail but any long distance will be trailered.

Ok let the questions and suck begin.

[moose]

What color is it gonna be?

[MultiScuf]

When will it be done?

[dieseldoc]

This will be a year out I bet. As the wrangler is almost payed off....
Color will be what ever I find for a good cost.

[dieseldoc]

hand drawing of cantilever
and pics of cantilever

[MultiScuf]

My buddy has an old J10 under 2k with motor an axles I think

[moose]

Color will be what ever I find for a good cost.
Just joking around about the color, seems it's the ONLY thing you haven't thought of!

[dieseldoc]

Multi- the J10s are cool but not what I want as a buklder.
If I did I would go get the j4000 my buddy has. Its the 3/4 ton he put a 60 up front as it has an olds 455 in it. To big and heavy.

[MultiScuf]

Multi- the J10s are cool but not what I want as a buklder.
If I did I would go get the j4000 my buddy has. Its the 3/4 ton he put a 60 up front as it has an olds 455 in it. To big and heavy.

Nice. I was just throwing it out there. I was looking into for more of a buggy build but I dont know much about fabbing or getting into the buggy life other than you need a trailer.

[Chris]

My buddy has an old J10 under 2k with motor an axles I think

Those are cool, go for it or at least post pics so others here can consider buying it.

[dieseldoc]

Right.
The J series trucks are way cool I had a 77 J10 with the 401 v8 and quadra trac with low range.
It was a honcho with blue levi denim interior.
That thing would just go!
Got rid of it when fuel want from .92 a gallon to near 2.00!
9mpg was just to expencive.

[Cr33p3r]

It's looking good Brandon, keep it going.

[Java]

The J-series talk reminded me of a chef that has been on PBS recently, she has a sweet J20 that is frequently on the show, she even cooks on the flatbed.

http://www.annabel-langbein.com/annabel/blog/the-real-star-of-the-show/

its in the beginning of this video:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsrJQ2ZbQ5U

[dieseldoc]

I must say I mis the J10 I had.
Was a 77 Hancho w/blue levi denim interior 401v8 quadra track w/low range box.
That thing would go just about where ever I pointed it.

[Cr33p3r]

There is one for sell up at Apex

[dieseldoc]

Cool but if I do a FSJ i would want a cherokee chief with the 401 and wide fenders....

[MultiScuf]

Buddys J10

[dieseldoc]

Dag is a little rough.....info?

[MultiScuf]

79 j10 amc 401 turbo 400 borg an Warner tcase for awd Dana 44 front 60 rear

[dieseldoc]

That thing is 6 bolt wheels. Its a half ton J10.
They come with D44 front and rear. The rear has slight passenger side offset as its AWD.
does it have low range? The lever is under your right leg under the leading edge of the seat.
It should also have a vacum dial lock in the glove box.....letteraly cardboard box....
This thing lock the xfer case to be 50/50 split.
In open opperation the front axle gets 20-30 % off the drive.
It can be turned into a 2wd selectable.
But them parts are way hard to find anymore.
The chain drive xfer cases in these will stretch and skip indise the case.... the front drive shafts like to come off and eat the back corner of the TH400 trans missin.
That trans is an odd ball as well.
Round bell house not the diamond top like in the chevy/GMC
so there is an adaptor plate to make the chevy stuff work.
This would be a good thing for uprade to say a 700r4.
The AWD works great as long as its tight and the vac lines have no leaks.
We added selectable lockers to a 4door with that set up.....wow be shure the thing will stop or you could be up a tree!
I mean WOW locked locked and locked...

[dieseldoc]

so we want out last weekend for a drive.
Ended up out on FS360 cedar mt. road, out by mettberry/longwater/hackett gutches,
Snow is deep this year, got sucked off into the deep stuff at one point and did some fender damage.

So comming soon will e front flat tube fenders with a matched set out back.
Plan is to use some 1 1/4 .120 tube and some 16g flatstock.
I dont like how wide mine are right not. 5inch is to much, but I think this jeep was sold in Utah thus it had to have full tire coverage.
Colorado we can get away with 2 inch of tire expossed, so a 4 inch flair will do just fine.
I wont e redonig the whole fender like most the DIY kits do.
As the outer skins are replacable I dont mind cutting up my now bent front fenders.

With the removal of the front sway bar a few months ago the front tires have impacted the fenders and snapped the plastic ones and bent the steel factory fenders, and the rears are suffering as well. my right rear got its tear last spring at mettberry.
the left rear is the last unmolested fender.

So I am nabing a bender from a friend and come the end of the month will be getting started on the new stuff. rears will be removale but yet heel straong to take a beating. some crusher ccornners might need be done as full skins to help here at some point.

oops.. booboo!

[redneck23ms]

i have 13.5" of tire exposed lol

[dieseldoc]

I know right.....but you trailer your jeep a lot to Alex.
In town on a daily driver the locals on the south side of town get a little upset about huge roster tails flying off the back.

[The StRanger]

City of Centennial dont like that at all !!

[dieseldoc]

Right....but yet they can't seem to fix any roads as well....big Tires required on these roads.

[dieseldoc]

Add flat tends to it a few weeks ago.
I like the look for sure.
But we sling crap all over the mirrors now.
All good in the grand scheme of things.

[Jim]

You say'n bigger mud flaps are needed? Big difference to the vehicle behind that traveled the same roads - but had wider flaps...

http://www.jimwilliamson.net/automobile/2014-05-30--trail--north-sand-hills/day1/img_2041.jpg

[dieseldoc]

Yup we look a bit like that when the weather goes bad.

But we like them the look good and are far stronger than the plastic ones we just busted up!

[dieseldoc]

So a Quadratec 2.t"lift has made its way into my hands.
Bonus
It was fairly easy to install.
The front want on well and easy.
The rear axle not so much.
The tracker bracket is of poor design to say the least.
After you install it with the factory track at bolt.
Drill 1/2" hole for a side bolt.
Now here is the issue.
You must now in not the long factory bolt to tighten the new bolt....what the hell!
Instead of stagering the hight of side bolt it is right in line with the factory bolt.
Thus take apart what you just put together....stupid engineering to say the least.
Then there is the factory farm side shock bolts, wow really 2 Tinny bolts with 120k miles worth of dirt and dust. Snap!
Out come the drill, oh wait you can get close Enoch to the frame to drill it straight.
So out comes the air hammer to bust the welded nut lose.

So a 4-6 hour install turned into 8 crap to say the least.

So after all the work I come to find out that my jeep was stock hight.

I now have the clearance I needed for my tires, am rid of my work out saggy coils and shocks.
The ride is stiffer and much more level, even without the sway bar.

[dieseldoc]

ok picture time now that we got a new computer!

well once I figure out why the upload is failing I will post pics

[dieseldoc]

so I had to resize pics for the uploads to work but here they are.

flat fender, seat, and lift

[dieseldoc]

holly crap now I got 2 that are up side down....dam it

[Tom]

holly crap now I got 2 that are up side down....dam itThat's from standing on your head while taking the pic, or from holding the camera upside down. Lol

[Chris]

That's from standing on your head while taking the pic

Gets my vote! :lmao:

Looking good Brandon!

[dieseldoc]

Cell phone sideways.

Thanks all.

So the front want up 1.5 inch and the rear want up 3.o inch.
2 inch leveling kit is all it had to clear the 33's.
It rides better now and not near as tippy.
Factory springs were waisted.

Some adjustable rear upper links are on the list now, got a slight vibration in the drive shaft.
Picking up the rock Trac case next month woo hoo 4:1 and slip eliminated from the rear of the case.

[dieseldoc]

Will be ordering these soon as they will lend to getting the vibration ok it of the rear end and help with shifting the rear back under the spring buckets
http://core4x4.lunasoft.com/core4x4.com/products/wrangler-tj-1997-2006/tier-one-18/tier-1-adjustable-rear-upper-control-arms-w-rubber.php

I will be cutting the powers from My Sami to make powers for the jeep.
Curently they are way to long.

[dieseldoc]

deathe wobble can bugger off!

So we have been batling death wobble for some time now.
The factory track bar bolt is dam small.
And the bushing is an issue as well.
I upgraded the axle side bushing to a synergy one with the 16mm bolt hole.
This will fix the hole on the frame sid ethat is now egg shaped from the small factory bolt that just can seem to stay tight no matter how hard I wrench it down.
So after carefully enlarging this hole to keep it round and strieght there is now a 16mm bolt in a hole that had a 7/16 or something tinny like that.
this is now using a stover lock nut as well, and the flat of the nut fit tight against the factory steel so no goofy tab needed.

The next thing that was torn up was the factory Mercades steering box.
wow these things are expencive if you can even find one.
I spent 3 days calling around to find a steering box.
NAPA cant even get one as their builder has not a one in the building
Same thign from all the other parts houses
Calle Red Head steering and they want near $700 for a reman box.....wow for a stock box so not happening.

So I ordered me a AGR sagnaw steering box last week, these are upgrades as they have a higher presure setting and a variable ratio in them 13/16:1
As well as the cool cap that they install
The install was a bit of work to say the least.
As my bugit is still very tight with Therse still not working.
It is recomended to replace the lower steering shaft, this will come as funds allow.
The 03-06 shaft is longer after the lower joint so the shaft hits the over flow tank
The colapsable side hast to get shorter by 2 1/4" this was the easy part.
Spent some extra time and greesed the bearing in the carrier for the shaft
Had to go buy the high pressure hose for the pump to steering box as the 04 hose will not work no matter how you try.
The return side was a bit fo work to get to clear the lower part of the grill assembly
The good thing was the pitman arm fit just fine

So in all the steering got upgraded and the track bar up graded as well.

Things are tight and right again
The steering is faster by a full turn now
Th steering box will turn 1 finger on pavment at idle with the 33s so inprovement there as well

Now for the all important PICS

[jayson44]

did you consider the durango steering box upgrade? probably cheaper than the AGR...

J.

[dieseldoc]

Ya, the Darango box was cheeper, but the ratio in it fixed.
The one I got is variable.
And it's new not a reman, the Darango boxes are reman

[JGRubicon]

Nice! Glad to hear you solved your death wobble, with an upgrade to boot!

Congrats!

[Dale]

Do you feel your new box is more robust than the OEM, Brandon? Any downside to the higher working pressure required? Looks like a mod to seriously consider especially since you've proven it to be a doable upgrade. I'll be "bending your ear" on this one for more specifics next time I see you.

[dieseldoc]

Dale, yes there is a vast improvement.
The working pressures are no issue for,the stock pump.
The box I chose has cooled fins in the end cap.
So that should help with fluid temps a little bit.
I am also using hydrolic fluid vs. ATF my pump had a little noise from being heated,
The noise has gone away.

At idle this box turns muy 33's lock to lock with 2 fingers on the wheel.
I bet with a PSC pump it would do it with 1 finger on the wheel.

I feel the Mercedes box is a waist of time.
I understand why it found its way into the wrangler but it was a poor place to save money.

Options for steering boxes,
One can use a Drango box
Or go back to a sagnaw style like I did.

It was a bit of work to make fit, the high presure hose from a 2002 is required
And the lower shaft has to be made shorter
But in all its a very doable deal.

[Dale]

That gearbox seems like a good solution. Brandon, I couldn't tell from the pix, how did you handle placement and mounting for the gearbox? Also, you've had your lift for a while now. Other than the trackbar, are you satisfied with performance and height, etc. for 33s?

[dieseldoc]

The placement on this box is the same as the 98-02, it uses the same holes etc so it's a bolt in.
The biggest issues are the hose and lower shaft.
Realy the box it's self was easy it's a bolt in deal.
It is working very well and a t lower cost than a remanufactured factory box.

The lift is working very nicely.
We still rub on the fire wall at full turn with one tire up in the fender.

The front track bar has been an issue well be for the lift want into the jeep.
For the cost it was a good option, used heavy duty springs as well.
It rides nicy, we have broke it in very well this summer and it is not saying or any thing like that.

[Dale]

I guess the 06 Wrangler may have the same steering setup .... have to check. On the lift, I wonder if its worth looking for an option that would permit getting a separate adjustable track bar. I'd like to make the axle bracket hole larger but am reluctant to drill another. Forgot to ask about the rear pinion, but it sounds like you may want to change the alignment if you are looking for some adjustable control links. Thanks for all the info, Brandon.

[dieseldoc]

The quadra tech kit uses the factory front and rear track bars. The rear gets a relocation bracket, the front stays stock.
An after market front like the JKS for 1-3" lift would be a great option.
The are right $240

The 2006 model uses the Mercedes box.

The kit alows for upgrading as one can acord to.
I will be getting the control arm set from CORE4x4. At $700 for all four with jonny joints on one end.

[Dale]

Your lift has been informative for me, Brandon. Now I understand what's needed for 33s. The flat fenders probably save you at least 1 1/2" - 2" in lift. I'm ambivalent on whether to save the stock fenders or put on some flats. The advantage of a lower c.g. and probably less driveline issues is very appealing. Still, I like the stock fender look. Now I know the difference and can make an informed decision after I get it down on paper. I still have some wobble issues but haven't completed a thorough inspection of the steering components. Good to have a practical option on the steering box if its showing excessive wear. The new track bar at least made it drivable on the highway. Sorry I couldn't make the cleanup run today. Sunday mornings are difficult for me.

[Jim]

The advantage of a lower c.g. and probably less driveline issues is very appealing.

I haven't been following along...

Are body lifts available for your model? I ask as you comment on having a lower CG / fewer driveline "undesirable" angles.

[dieseldoc]

There are body lifts available.
I don't recommend more than an inch as it create shifter issues with T-case.
Yes the flat fenders save me near 2 inch of lift.
But as the jeep had 33's on it when I bought it, I don't think anything more than the 2.5 inch is needed.
Wheels make a big difference as the wheels I have keep the tires off the control arms.
Dale your LJ will have much less drive line vibration as you have the longer wheel base and the Rubicon has the slip home eliminated from the factory. So that frees you up for going into a 3.5 inch kit the Quadra teck 3.5 inch kit has new lower arms to correct pinion angles, sway bar diconects and the case lowering kit needed for the short wheel base.


After a good day on the trail I must say that I am very pleased with my steering box.
The Darango box would have left me with a less performing box.
I have noticed less body roll with steering as the box is not forcing the frame over.

Dale,if you would you may bring your jeep by the shop any time and I will help you figure out your wobble issues.
Keep in mind if you have a sloppy box it will wobble no later what you do.
I,had play from the 11 o'clock to the 1 o'clock position on the steering wheel
This is way out of spec and way beyond what DOT dems safe in a truck.

[Dale]

Jim, the reason I mention driveline issues is that the majority of threads I've read with higher lifts mention driveline vibration issues and dropping the transfer case and/or changing pinion angle with adjustable control arms to overcome these issues. It seems that some if not all the lower lifts don't find it necessary to include control arms. Unless I'm misinterpreting your question, several mfrs. list 1" to 1.25" body lifts for the TJ and similar motor mount lifts. I've also thought about 35s with flat fenders but then I'm getting into a gear change and beefier front end components, no?

[dieseldoc]

Dale with your longer wheel base drive line issues are far less of an issue. And with the Rubicon it's even less issue.
As I mentioned in my last responce you won't need to drop the T-case tell you get into 4 plus inch of lift.
With the 3.5 inch from quadratec you would do very well to clear 33's
Your Rubicon has the stronger front axle as well.
The center section is the d44 the rest is still d30 stuff.
Some adujustable upper arms would be a good idea for alignment.
Core4x4 offers there stuff in upper and lower sets as well as front of rear.
I don't see a need for 35's unless you plan to get into some of the harder stuff sooner.
We have been running 33's and go the same places as our friends on 35's.
Its all driver experience that will get you in and put.
As you mentioned 35's will force you to spend on gears, and shafts at some point.
The way you are set up now 33's will not.

[Java]

Charles Wells' TJ, the guy who writes the Fun Treks books, has a 3" lift, ARBs and 33s, he does every trail in the book. I just saw their new one going over Red Cone, it's a JKU with a 1.5" lift and 33" Grabber ATs.

Nice job on the steering box, Brandon. :thumb:

[dieseldoc]

Thanks Paul.
Its a totally different jeep now.

[Dale]

Brandon, we cross posted yesterday evening so I missed your first set of comments then. You and Paul make some persuasive arguments for not jumping into 35s. I am &nbsp;now satisfied there will be plenty of time down the road to make further changes; if indeed I ever feel the need. So I've decided to plan for 33s (maybe it's 315s on 16" wheels). Presently, I think I would like to hang on as many adjustable components as are likely to be required in the future. So I'm thinking of adjustable control arms and track bars front and rear. Also I'd like to explore the Nth Degree Lightning quick disconnect. (It is a lever setup that permits reconnecting with up to 8" height difference side to side.) Wonder if anyone on the forum is a user?<br>
<br>
If I purchase the mentioned items separately, looks like I just need a basic lift with only springs and shocks. Have looked at Quadratec and Rough Country 3.5 and 3.25 respectively. Also looked at Iron Rock ... but I think their kit is a Rough Country. I will likely stick with Quadratec or Rough Country as you and Paul, respectively, have favorable experience with them. The complete kits don't seem to suit my thoughts as they have some component that is not adjustable like track bar or control arms. They also include quick disconnects which I won't need if indeed the Nth Degree part is worthwhile.<br>
<br>
Appreciate your offer of an assist on the wobble. That will be helpful, for sure. I'm sorry I missed the cleanup run yesterday. Sounds like it was a useful test for your improved steering setup. Isn't it terrific when a plan comes together? That steering box substitution is one cool mod!<br>

[dieseldoc]

The control arms I am going to use are a nice set, they ha a favorable write ups and are resionable in cost.
You can order them in a wide variety of colors.
They use ruber on the frame side to isolate vibration and road noise.
Flex joints on the other ends.
And the full set for front rear upper lower is 700, CORE 4x4. Americian made in UT.

The steering box was a tough call but I am glad I want with the AGR box and not a Durango one.
After speaking with Dave (your passenger for the last clean up) I feel the extra expence was well worth it.
I do need a steering pump as mine is failing from being heated, but that will come next month some time.
I am going to install the PSC one with resivore.
It has higher flow rate and higher pressures, it can run a ram if I ever go that way.
I don't think hydro assist will need to go on the jeep as it won't get anything bigger than a 35 inch tifre, as I am keeping it streetable.
I am building a bigger rig for the hard core stuff. And Threads will drive this so it needs to stay easy to drive.

Sounds like you have a plan figured out, now it's time to research the parts before dropping your funds on things.

My lift seems to be doing a very good job, heavier springs have made the ride in town a little rougher, just a little. They are taking the abuse well, and has I wheel it hard so it's proving to be of quality.

[Dale]

Definitely looks like you will be set for a while with a great wheeling rig when you get those control arms installed. Im not familiar with the PSC pump you mention. Is it an oem item? I'm keen to have that information in my file.

[newracer]

PSC is an aftermarket power steering pump.

[dieseldoc]

Pac is one of the top manufacures for,modified pump and steering set up with hydro assist.
The pump I will be using is set up to run a ram, yet still has the results attached,to it to keep the stock location.
This pump will help the box I installed to run even better.

Thank you Dale I,spend a lot of time researching products before I buy.
I don't want to have to buy something twice...thus my discust with the track bar issue.

[dieseldoc]

So I have in stalled the control arms from CORE4x4 in the past month.
WOW.....I still had a slight bit of death wobble trying to show up.
This was caused by the bushings in the control arms being totally worn out.
I even had one that was bent!
So after installing the new control arms ( thanks kurts)
The jeep behaves like it should.
The steering doesn't make the jeep lean anymore, as well as corners and getting into it.
I still have the front sway bar removed and it drives as if it was there.....
In this install I moved the front coward 1/2" to hopefully get the tires off the fire wall at full stuff.


Next on the list is to replace the rear carrier.
As it was welded a few years ago as I was on a super tight budget and wanted it locked.
This summer (435th of July on red elephant hill) the welds let go.
I have welded them back up, thus making the carrier out of balance.
This vibration is magnified as the driveline angle is a touch off for the rear as well.

The plan,
A jana k4 instal. http://www.jantz4x4.com/jantz.php?p=detail&pro=jana_k4
This uses the new school gears from a JK as well as the carrier to add near 45% increase in strength
The kit also us3s a new diff cover with bearing cap strength.
Itukeeps the caps from deflecting.

I have piced up a D44 30 spline Yukon grizzly locker for 300, it was a scratch/dent/out of box deal.
It's for the 3.73 and down to make this work.
Now with use of different bearings and races the JK d44 gears will fit my TJ d44 housing.

Pics to come as parts trickle in.

[moose]

Glad you got those control arms put in and nice score on the locker. I think it'll work better on the trail than the TruTrac you were contemplating.

[dieseldoc]

Ya this is full locker like the Detroit.
The biggest thing I am doing with it now is the jk44 gear upgrade with cap splat bolts!
No deflection thicker and larger gears the ring goes to 8.8 up from 8.5.
The gear cuts have more curve in them and a touch deeper....this translates to better gear engagment!


Drew hope you get you engine back soon man.

[dieseldoc]

ok here is the all important pics

so we have the arms that replaced the worn out factory stamped junk

then we have the old busted and the new hinny that will go in with the Jana K4 kit

[jayson44]

doing my "new" arms this weekend. did you just set them to the same length as the stock arms?

J.

[dieseldoc]

Jason, rears are 1/4" longer and the front are 1/2" longer to push the front forward to get the tires off the fire wall at full stuff.

[jayson44]

did it work? I'm going to start with mine the same length. the rear already contacts the gas tank skid a little at full stuff (8.8 doesn't always play well in the stock location). and I don't have adjustable front uppers yet, so I'll not mess with that either.

J.

[dieseldoc]

Yup worked super well.
Have not stuffed it in the wheel well yet but by the numbers the front is forward enough to fix the issue. The rear is back to center under the jeep.

The JK arms are a huge upgrade compaired to the TJ stuff.

Hope you get yours beack to the way you want.

As for the 8.8.....screw the Ford stuff, check out the link post about the Jana K4!
I am adding 44% strength to my factory axle by using his set up!

[jayson44]

what do you mean about the JK arms? the arms you have pictured are for a TJ...

as for the 8.8, your Jana upgrade has made your ring gear the same size as mine, and I've seen the stock 31-spline shafts hold up to a buggy on 37s for 8 years. I've got no qualms w/the 8.8. and the upgrade-ability of this axle is impressive as well. if it ain't broke, don't fix it. :)

J.

[dieseldoc]

Ya, the arms I used are for the TJ,.

One compare the TJ stock stamped stuff to the arms on the JK the factory did some big inprovments for sure.


As for the Jana upgrade I am about to do, I could in theory run 37's on it with some shaft upgrades, yet then I have to do a front axle upgrade for it to work.
As well as 4" more lift and some wheel base work.....

[jayson44]

As well as 4" more lift and some wheel base work.....

ah, wheelbase...on TJ's that's where the Just Empty Every Pocket comes in. gas tank, steering, wheel wells...it's just not easy! shoot, I'd be happy to just be able to move my front axle forward 2-3" w/out having to go full hydro!

J.

[dieseldoc]

Astro box! Or the 2011 and newer dodge 4500 an 5500
They use rversed boxes!
Same bolt pattern for the dodge stuff.
This would let you move the front with less issues, but more like 6" forward.

Ya wheel base stretch is expencive!

[dieseldoc]

Jason, not sure if you have checked these put yet,
http://core4x4.lunasoft.com/core4x4.com/products/wrangler-tj-1997-2006/tier-one-18/

I like the arms build quiality, and you can get just uppers or lowers in different colors and with flex joints for realy nice prices, as well as US made!

[jayson44]

yeah, I was checking those out, but I fell across a set of Rock Krawler Super Flex double-adjustables for $50 for the set (minus front uppers). I've spent $60 rebuilding them, so I can't complain. :)

J.

[newracer]

ah, wheelbase...on TJ's that's where the Just Empty Every Pocket comes in. gas tank, steering, wheel wells...it's just not easy! shoot, I'd be happy to just be able to move my front axle forward 2-3" w/out having to go full hydro!

J.

https://www.tntcustoms.com/jeep_parts/tj_lj_steering_stretch_kit_steering_box_rotation

[dieseldoc]

Nice kit.

[dieseldoc]

So I have been on the phone with Carl Janz a few times today.
Should have all my parts toghter tomorrow.

Great service very personable.
Great service so far.
Talked jeeps for half hour at the end of the call.

[dieseldoc]

Estimate for my parts, including set up bearing for the diff as well as replacement bearings as my side bearings are damaged.

802 with shipping.

Will post pics this week when parts come in.
Next weekend will be a repair weekend.

[MultiScuf]

The rigs looking great man! Can't wait to see the pictures

[dieseldoc]

Thanks Brandon.

[dieseldoc]

Part made it into the shop today.
Post man says they have been at DIA sense saturday! WTF

Pics will come tomorrow.
Install on Saturday.

I do have to ream the bolt holes on the new carrier from 7/16 to 1/2 as the ring gear is of the 1/2 variety.

[dieseldoc]

So I am stalled out for the install. The guys at NAPA cant figure out the unjoint strap needed with this new yoke. so I will be a few weeks before it goes in.
I have to figure out the resize issue so I can post pics.
as well I am now at a hight that a SYE kit has to go in so I dont have a bind up issue, and end up busted.
so here comes a weekend of work after the holidays.
This is also forced my hand to get the skid plat done as I will be pushing the engine and drivetrain up to create clearance under the belly. yet still keep the low stance.

[Chris]

Bummer Brandon, delays are discouraging.

Use this to resize - http://www.picresize.com/

[newracer]

I like Fotosizer to resize picts.

[Spieg]

Good 'ol Microsoft Paint will also work to resize (scale) photos.

[dieseldoc]

Sweet thanks for the info....


Got the right u joint strap kits ( cup holder )

Had to be from a '76 IH scout!

[dieseldoc]

So my TJ has reach a point where it needed some stuff.
I have years of the 4.10 type has 3.73 in it now and is just not the right gears for the 33's.
Reat gears are of the JK variety, the JANA kit will put these into my D44
Rear Yukon grizzly locker
Front carier for the diff just in case it has 3.55 but the manual has the 3.73......
Front and rear master install kits rear has the crush sleeve eliminated
Front brakes are get rotors they are due so some upgraded rotors an pads
Rear New drums and shoes and hardware
Steering pump has finally gone enough.....so a PSC replacement will go in as well as a good sized cooler to,keep the type u,see control.
Front axle seals are getting the treatable type
And some synergy ball joints
And front unit bearings just a touch of play so 60 bucks for the,pair and they are getting done.....

Pics,will come,as,parts come,in.

[dieseldoc]

So I had a long weekend of stuffing parts into the jeep.

The Jana K4 kit:

This was to be quality parts.....
Well the set up bearings were tighter fit than wide bearings for the carrier.....grrr!
Had to source bearings on a 3 day weekend! :oops:
Next the install says the solid spacer was to be .450" well not some much.
I was sent a spacer that measures .410" so to start with I am all ready short .040"
Next instructions say start with .100" of shimms, hmmm that would be nice.
Kit arrived with .080" worth of shimms crap....:bang:

I got to spend half my day building a custom spacer to replace the one I payed for....:bang:

the rest want in nicely after I was able to get preload and depth set right.

I evidently have a vent axle shaft....made it worse pressing the bearing back on after replacing the seal. This is most likely the culprit of my oil leak..
So axle shafts will be coming this week.

The Yukon grizzly I got needed the bolt holes drilled to 1/2 this fast and easy.

The front was a pain to get out...but I was able to pull the bearings, hone them out to be set up bearings, life is so much better this way.
Front diff in an set.
I install ed a set of ten factory Greasable axle tube seals.
The ball joint were not totally wasted, but they were poping some.
So synergy manufacturing got the funds for these parts.
Greasable lowers....sweet
Replaced the unit bearings as they have 129, 347 miles on then.
And for $60 for the pair done.

The slight jump in gears is not totally evident but the low gears like reverse.
Will see how it does on the hills.

I got some turning radius back as this locker has good amount of give in it.
Granted it has like 15 miles one right now....

Ask all in all a long weekend but it's mostly done.

Still have steering pump to do, a steering cooler to install as well 5/8"engine lift to install, build trans cross member to bring the t-case up 5/8" as well.
Build a new skid plate as well.

[TJS86TOY]

Bummer about the missing parts. Seems like quality parts are a hard find these days, but it seems like you pulled it all together nicely. Ha! Saw your sig. "All I wanted was a pepsi, just one pepsi! " Ya, Im from that gen.

[dieseldoc]

Dig deep it to your pockets
Make it hurt
How much you makes no difference to me.
How much you give is your,own choice
But for me it's the difference between a porch and Rolls Royce

Got to love ST!

Any how ya my weekend was kind screwed as someone else made big misstakes.
Grant it I didn't measure every thing when the box showed up.
So my bad there but dam man, pay a guy 9 bones for a kit he puts together you would think the stuff would be right.

[dieseldoc]

So I have talked with Carl Jantz himself about the issues I had with his kit.

The solid spacer was being made by an outside manufacture.
Carl has gone through his parts on the shelf.
Of the 50 he has on the shelf 3 are out of parallel.
They very from .410 to .430 has 5 that were correct.

The shimms are supplied from Revtek or Yukon seems they change the amount of shimms on a regular basis.
So he is going to be building the packs himself after he recives them from the supplier.

The bearing was NAPA giving him the wrong stuff....

So in all things will get better with his stuff.

Mine got done and works nicely.