From Anniv Thread - Forum Activity Level

[TDash]

this is by far the smallest anniv run i have seen in years, that's sad.

[Jim]

It's a small'n - but it's happening. It is good to see new folks jumping into the mix to contribute! (edit - contribute = getting the anniv run scheduled / on the calendar)

A different vehicle-tied forum I spend some time with has a similar comment floating about - forum activity is down the past few years. Our activity is down too. Now to see what happens when the trails are open and people are getting out.

[Java]

I'm in a few groups and aside from this one and one I haven't participated in for years, colorado4x4.org, they are all super busy. GMJC just had it's first trail run and it was so full they scheduled the same run for the next day, RMO had a trip that was so full they scheduled the same one for the next week to accommodate more people and there is a waiting list for everything they post.


I have noticed two differences between the busy groups and the not busy ones:

-The ones that allowed political discussion during the crazy last few years have had a lot of attrition, we're all sick of that ****.

-The ones like MHJC with a schedule of events for the season are busy because, in my opinion, people have something to join in with instead of having to initiate which can be a lot especially for a new person.


These are empirical observations, nothing more, I am not criticizing anyone and have no suggestions. I participated in the political BS as much as anyone and have put up feelers but have not scheduled anything, haven't actually been on or posted up a frontrange4x4 run in a while. I am not talking about anyone or pointing fingers at anyone except maybe myself.

[FINOCJ]

-The ones like MHJC with a schedule of events for the season are busy because, in my opinion, people have something to join in with instead of having to initiate which can be a lot especially for a new person.

As we've discussed before, I do think this is the big issue. But it also takes someone's time and effort and pre-planning organization. Just to ask, do those other groups have dues or some sort of fees to participate with? Obviously we are essentially free...I recognize I am not really in position to participate anymore on a consistent basis (move out of state), but its not that hard to kind of put together a a schedule of say 6 runs during the summer months and get them posted on the schedule. There are 4 that always happen - the two anniversary runs and the two clean-up runs. Add in a couple of usually very popular runs - say MSV/Coney and a Gulches run, and you that should be one run per month that is on the schedule EARLY - like March early. Having set runs on the schedule early is a big deal to me - those with busy family schedules have a chance to plan around it. All the standard, plan the week of (or a couple weeks out), can fill in the other weekends - and once people get out on the primary monthly run, I bet the side of trail conversations will lead to more runs as people get to know one another and discuss wheeling etc.

As a side note, I also think that the 'big group' runs would have a different feel - a bit more social (like the clean-ups and anni runs). One of the reasons some of us really like this site was option to throw together a quick run with a small group at unusual time/day - mostly because many of us prefer wheeling with a small group on harder trails, and don't necessarily love the structure of more formalized clubs. But I think these kind of runs are built from the relationships and conversations developed at the big group runs.


-The ones that allowed political discussion during the crazy last few years have had a lot of attrition, we're all sick of that ****.
If people are comfortable discussing, how big of an issue was this topic for FR4x4?

Finally, I am realizing how cyclical life and nature is....Life priorities, situations and families change on a somewhat 5-10 year cycle. Normally this turn-over is evenly distributed throughout the membership, with some moving on, and others joining in on at evenly distributed rate. Seems as though we've had a lot of active membership turn-over recently, and lost lots of previously active members (such as myself). Even my own client base in Montana has a sort of cycle to it - often tied to school age children eventually graduating HS and all of a sudden, the family's typical schedule is completely different with different priorities. Add in the affect of Covid where a bunch of families changed typical travel routines all at once (stopped coming), and it seems like instead of the usual slow rate of turn-over, all of a sudden I lost 80% of my client base, and am creating an all new client base. Three years in, and it seems like its starting to stabilize once again - but with all new clients. I kind of feel like FR4x4 membership is doing this - lots of the classic members have moved on (possibly accelerated by covid and politics) and lots of new members signing up, but without much 'leadership'....and by leadership, I just mean experienced members posting runs and sharing info and helping organize based on their experience, which makes it much easier for new members to jump in and participate.

Last topic along these lines....there is a history of wheeling clubs not just for shared experience among those interested to wheel, but also as a safety net. Always go with a group just in case, etc. A lot of the common experience of these clubs included wrenching a bit on rigs and trail repairs and whatnot. These days, a relatively new 4x4 is pretty much 99% reliable, and in most places say in Colo, its not that hard to find help if needed (being in MT now, I am again aware of what its like to truly wheel in REMOTE areas without easy access to help). With my Tacoma - Jen and I used to wander 60-100 miles out into the Utah desert on back dirt roads and whatnot without too much concern - don't think I'd take one of my old jeeps there without some other vehicles along. And it seems almost everyone has a new modern rig in Colo these days! Whats the point in inviting a group of other rigs along if you can just go yourself on your own time schedule etc....There has to be an additional aspect that makes you want to have others along - initially for me, it was the classic old jeep isn't necessarily all that reliable concern (and some of you all helped me out with that when needed - hopefully the jeep has proven itself reliable after the first couple years). For others, its either social (which is possibly where topics like politics and religion etc can be helpful or a turn-off), or just sharing trail knowledge the old fashion way (but even that is limited - there is more info online than anywhere else). Hard trails can be a draw - its nice to have extra support for winching, strapping etc - but not sure we have that much hard-core crowd anyway. What else is there?

[newracer]

I would have went but my club is working with the FS to check the conditions of our adopted roads this weekend to see if they can be opened as scheduled.

Traffic on this site has always been low and even less since Facebook took off, that's pretty common for all forums. The OP mentions colorado4x4.org, that site used to have an enormous amount of traffic with several trips planned every month. It's a ghost town now.

My club has a scheduled trip every month and we average about 15 rigs in the winter and 25 in the summer depending on location. We currently have 98 members.

[Java]

As we've discussed before, I do think this is the big issue. But it also takes someone's time and effort and pre-planning organization. Just to ask, do those other groups have dues or some sort of fees to participate with?

Both.

[Jim]

-The ones like MHJC with a schedule of events for the season are busy because, in my opinion, people have something to join in with instead of having to initiate which can be a lot especially for a new person.

Paul, would you be interested in planning and leading a couple "long-scheduled" runs? One scheduled at one month out and a second at two months out (just a suggestion as to timeframe - longer calendar listing for folks to schedule around)?

It'd be interesting to see the interest level!

[Java]

I don't have the time to commit to anything through the end of August, but I'd be a maybe for anything that does get posted. I have stopped taking weekends off and have three multiday solo overland trips scheduled for weekdays through August so I'm not really able to commit to runs ahead of time. I can always take last minute time off so I'm watching.

If anyone is interested in the South Fork area the last week of this month hit me up. We're still watching road closures...

You're on the right track with long-scheduled runs, OTHJC had two runs at Miller Rock last week that were full with waiting lists. They send out a schedule at the beginning of the year and update it as they add to it so it's easy for people to plan ahead for them.

[Java]

Paul, would you be interested in planning and leading a couple "long-scheduled" runs? One scheduled at one month out and a second at two months out (just a suggestion as to timeframe - longer calendar listing for folks to schedule around)?

It'd be interesting to see the interest level!

Just posted a feeler for Slaughterhouse and China Wall, we'll see...

[RockyMtRebel]

I’m a pretty active wheeler but I have avoided joining any clubs because I really don’t enjoy wheeling with large groups. The few large group events I’ve been on have not given me the element of adventure that wheeling solo or with just a couple other rigs does.
I enjoy planning routes and I’m usually the one who does, but since I’m not a club member that comes with the territory! I just posted a planned Spring Creek run for next week, but I do realize most folks won’t be able to wheel during the eeek 🤷🏽*♂️

[Java]

I'm in a few groups just to have more options to wheel. No mega runs, the only huge groups I've seen are Rock Junction and Easter Jeep, aside from events like that nobody likes large groups. Every group I'm in limits runs to maybe 5-8 rigs then does waiting lists or a second wave, and in reality you always have 100 people interested and maybe a handful at the trailhead. Frontrange used to have huge runs that we'd break up into waves too, all the groups are essentially the same thing with nuances. The Maze run on this forum is also an Overland Bound run, it's all the same.

[Mountaineer01]

Paul, would you be interested in planning and leading a couple "long-scheduled" runs? One scheduled at one month out and a second at two months out (just a suggestion as to timeframe - longer calendar listing for folks to schedule around)?

I was thinking about this and I wouldn't mind putting together a long term monthly run on the calendar. Maybe we choose a recurring day each month like other forums (1st, 2nd, or 3rd Sunday for example) and we can alternate easy/moderate/difficult trails so that we have something for everyone and people can plan ahead. I wouldn't be able to make all (or most) of them but I could probably organize it. Is that something we would be interested in?

[Jim]

Give it a shot and see what happens!

[xaza]

I used to make runs almost every week. An influx of newbies showing up on runs not knowing the basics of wheeling or how to turn a wrench turned me off of the bigger group runs. I am the type of person who will not leave someone behind and do anything I can to get them home safely. This made runs more of a chore than enjoyable. Too many people not doing proper maintenance and rig checks pre-run made the break downs just too common. A couple newbs on a run is not bad but when 6 of 7 others fit this bill it just drags a day along. I found a couple new passions in life and my wheeling time has suffered but I plan to be rectifying that by this time next year, but when I do post up runs I tend to not leave a lot of time for people to plan ahead to keep numbers down. Personally I prefer 5 or less rigs on a run unless it is just an easy cruising day. I suppose I could put a limit on number of rigs unless another person is willing to lead a second wave. Still could end up in same situation just more spread out but is worth a try. I really look forward to getting to know more of the newer people on this forum as most of my regular friends here have moved on. Going to make one more run in XJ before she finds a new home. If I get my maintenance and trail checks in I will post it up.

[Jim]

The first time I was pulled off of a trail (Ironclads), it was you that lent a strap... I most thank you for the assistance. (fuel pump died)

Rob and Chris also helped me get through the day and get to home.

Putting a vehicle limit on a run - something the coordinator certainly can establish.

`it'd be good to shake hands again this summer!

[Java]

Cliff getting pulled out by Rick @3:15, can't believe this was 10 years ago! Rick's truck was the ultimate recovery vehicle. :thumb:


https://vimeo.com/67534571

https://vimeo.com/67534571

[Mountaineer01]

Personally I prefer 5 or less rigs on a run unless it is just an easy cruising day. I suppose I could put a limit on number of rigs unless another person is willing to lead a second wave.

In my year here we haven't had a run over 5 trucks (except the clean up run) and that was the crux of this thread (low turnout on the anniversary run) so the pendulum has swung completely in the other direction. The goal now is to get more people involved which is where the idea of more organized and longer advance planned runs came in.

That being said, I think it is a good point that when you get to 6+ trucks it can make for a long and sometimes frustrating day out, so I was thinking of limiting group size to 6. If more people than that sign up, it gets broken up into two groups.