58 Willys Wagon

[FINOCJ]

A little update....got it torn down to bare block....


The oiling issue seems more pervasive than just rod #1...some of the other main bearings aren't looking as good as they should - no grooves but way too much wear for the limited mileage.


The #5 rod bearing is also bad - showing copper and did a bit of damage to the crank:


Originally, I was hoping this was a single oil galley issue and machining the crank journals, new undersize bearings, honing the cylinders and basic parts (bearings, gaskets, rings) would be enough. Wasn't sure about cam bearings etc....but that is all moot now. I knew I was running into a lot more bearing damage than originally thought... A local engine shop took a look at the parts/block...He checked a few common mistakes or errors that can happen (missing plugs or non-functional relief valve on the oil pump) that can starve oil, but everything seems in order in that regard. Its possible that somehow the crank/main bearings were somehow out of tolerance with the line bore, but that is pretty rare. Basically, his best guess is it seems like there was some sort of contamination in the oil....there is even signs of wear at the rocker arms on the top of the springs, and at the pivot balls, cam as well as decent circle wear on the bottom of the lifters - Seemed some of the convexity was flattened out. So anything that was oiled had wear - but what contaminated the oil? His best guess is something like Al oxide that gets used in various abrasives/scotchbrite when people are cleaning gasket surfaces and what not, gets embedded into the rough casting of the block and is really hard to clean out - even typical machine shop jet washes won't remove all of it. I didn't use anything like that on the block, but it can get into the jet wash at shops like his from someone else's block and then it contaminates all subsequent blocks that are used in that jet wash. I don't know....I guess the biggest concern would be if Al oxide contaminated the entire system, there is no easy way to get it all out, and any future build with the block is a bit risky....probably will need to disassemble the heads completely and wash them as well, and the intake if i stay with the same one.
In short, For over $1000 (and 4 months out) for machine work and parts, plus some risk that I cannot get it cleaned out well enough and will end up back in this same spot in a year....I am going with an assembled sbc350 short block from S&J engines - its close enough in the Spokane, WA area that i can go pick it up and trade my core to avoid shipping costs and hassles. Still going to be over 2 months out, but I am going to Alaska for a big chunk of that, and have plenty of other upgrades to do while the willys sits. While going through this, looking at doing some other upgrades and things I never but probably should have done the first time through.

[Jim]

Sounds good to cut bait and not risk it.

[FINOCJ]

Disheartening in the sense that I wanted to run an engine that I built - well really assemble - but in the long run, the real 'building' part is more about the machine work anyway. Assuming I get full core return, the short block will come completely assembled minus the oil pump - which is provided but not installed. That includes fresh machined block and crank, cleaned and prepped block with all proper plugs etc, installed crank, main bearings, installed rods and pistons and rod bearings, installed cam bearings and cam, installed complete timing set, installed 2-piece RMS, and painted for an additional $80 - total cost is $1700. That isn't much more than the machine shop estimate, and removes some of the risk. It hurts a bit considering what I already put into the engine, but the willys is useless without one - looking at it in the garage isn't worth a thing to me. There is still some big spending to come in the budget with TBI system - skipping out on the carb. I already had picked up an aftermarket aluminum intake with square bore bolt pattern that will work better with the TBI, will still need to figure out new fuel pump and maybe a gas tank - looking at a 90s TBI chevy van tank that will up my fuel capacity significantly, and is set-up with an in tank TBI pump. The final question will be whether to add aftermarket aluminum heads to go with the intake, or stay with iron heads i was using before (after a complete disassembly and cleaning). Heat control and heat soak has been an issue, and with the carb, its been boiling the fuel out of the bowl after it sits turn-off for a few minutes. I also haven't been able to lean the carb out enough - partially I think because the heat and fuel boiling was causing issues with the gaskets and dripping fuel down the throat. Some of that was my fault in not blocking off the carb pre-heat exhaust passages in the intake that go under the carb...TBI will help that, aluminum top end pieces can also help dissipate heat....the intake will help, but maybe just go all out with aluminum heads as well (plus some performance gains). The TBI unit I am looking at (holley sniper) has the control board/switches (computer) mounted in the throttle body (as opposed to remotely somewhere else), which makes for a very clean install, but exposes the unit to more heat. Plus, I've never been successful getting any gasket to seal the VCs on the iron heads. Maybe there is a cool factor with all aluminum top end? I thought there was a sort of old school cool with all iron pieces last time.

[TjMike]

Tough break but agree with Jim and think you're making the right move. It's hard giving up on all that work you've put into it but having a reliable engine will make up for it.

[Jim]

A couple things reading your recent post...

So, you might re-use the heads that were on the unknown damaging particulate motor? I'd lean more heavily to the go aluminum and not re-use old motor items - no chance of damage to the new motor (I'm being overly cautious).

Second, on the boiling fuel - I had such an issue on a 68 Ford Wagon - v8. It kept boiling fuel such that when I'd come back from a long enough drive (didn't take too long), I'd turn the car of, get out and walk near the engine and I could hear boiling liquid sounds. In the end, I figured the intake exhaust pre-heat for the carb was passing too much exhaust gas so I figured I'd stop all exhaust gas flow. For a test, I put a thin metal shim / block at one of the sides - between the intake man & head. That didn't do the trick - a short time later - boiling fuel. I pulled the shim only to find it was blown apart. End of the story - this exhaust setup did not use any mechanical valve to bias exhaust flow through the intake but rather had a permanent inside-the-exhaust tube restrictor tube for one of the banks. That inner restriction tube had collapsed completely shut (the exhaust system looked perfect on the outside). One bank had all of its exhaust passing through the intake manifold. I removed the exhaust and could tap my flat palm at each exhaust manifold tube (on the exhaust) - different tones were produced. I pulled a hacksaw and cut the 'dead' sounding tube and that's when I saw the inner restrictor pipe collapsed closed.

Any chance your exhaust system could be doing the same to your carb heating? Try the flat palm drum tap on the open tube ends - do they sound the same?

[xaza]

rough luck James. Great write up on your process. I put an engine from S&J Engines in the XJ. I had great success with the engine and it was still running great when I sold the truck. Only put about 15k miles on it but ran solid and strong.

[FINOCJ]

Jim previously posted:

[Jim]

$950?

[Mountaineer01]

Jim previously posted:

[TyTheJeepGuy]

*sweating because I 100% used scotchbrite on the block head gasket surface*

[FINOCJ]

TyTheJeepGuy previously posted:

[FINOCJ]

A small update....been doing a lot of tedious and time consuming work on the 58 project, but seems like it never really gets anywhere....but I did get the rebuilt engine back together and that seems worthy of celebration. It has a rebuilt shortblock from S and J engines, and then I added my old heads and whatnot, plus a new aluminum Edelbrock intake. The carb set-up is hopefully only temporary, as the plan is to go TBI, but getting the gas tank and fuel pump aspects figured has been difficult. Plus, i am not sure I trust trying to start up the fresh engine with flat tappet cam on a TBI system I've never run. Given how senstitive these cams are to getting destroyed during initial start up and break-in, I am going to go with the tried and true qjet carb that it was running on previously. Plus, that buys me some more time to figure out the gas tank and TBI.


Also, got it attached to the rest of the drivetrain:


It'll go in as one big unit, but we are also working on a few other willys projects, so it'll be a bit before actual install. While it was all out, I did some minor rebuild of the Warn overdrive shift assembly and synchronizers - it seemed to like to upshift just fine, but something was binding on the downshift. I actually kind of like messing with various gear boxes:


New shift hub and sliding collar, new dogs and springs, new blocking rings, new gaskets.....won't know if it's till its all back and running:


We got quite a bit of interior work going on as well - Jen has really been helping with that....

[Jim]

Progress!

If I can help with respect to FI pump in a mechanical pump tank setup - holler. I have some "life experience" education with mine.

What PSI is your FI pump putting out? Mine is something low - 25 to 40psi (at the rail) IIRC.

[FINOCJ]

Jim previously posted:

[Jim]

You're talking about replacing the main fuel tank,yes? Have you thought about adding a small 1 or 2 gallon tank for the FI pump and the main and underseat keep this FI tank full?

My tank is the original carb setup tank - the sending unit is a bit cobbled together to get the pump onto it. Could you do the same? Do you have any photos of your sending unit and tank connection?

[FINOCJ]

Jim previously posted:

[Jim]

Do you have any pictures of the 58's sending unit (out of the tank) and the mounting hole, in the tank, for the sending unit?

EDIT: I guess, nevermind as you're looking for a larger tank.

[FINOCJ]

I think its ready for initial start-up and (cam) break-in......going to go through and double check the basics tomorrow morning when i am not so tired, then prime the oil pump, install the distributor and wires and see what happens. I get why people use engine run stands, as it is a lot of work to get it into the rig and then get all the other stuff hooked up. But, assuming it all goes well, it'll pretty much be ready to drive around during run-in and finish seating the rings etc for the next few weeks. Lots of other side projects going on with it.....TBI/gas tank, interior upgrades etc that I can update after its running and driving again. I am a bit worried about the OD I did some work on back a few posts - hard to explain, but it seems like the sliding collar might be jammed up a bit making it not want to shift. Hopefully once things are spinning and some oil gets slung around, it'll shift normally. time for a beer.....

[FINOCJ]

Going to ignore the engine aspect of the project for a bit longer.....things haven't gone as smoothly as I was hoping....but while it has some down time, I did figure out how to get some 3pt seat belts mounted into it.....for now its just the passenger side, but it does give proof of concept. Driver side is to come....Jim - you want the old lap belts from your YJ back?

The hard part of this is getting some sort of solid mount for the shoulder point. A threaded backing plate mount has to be fished up inside the B-pillar and then held in place enough that you can then get the should point bolt etc mounted. I was fully prepared to drill a small access hole at the bottom of the B-pillar (that was going to be hidden behind the retractor box), but I got lucky and didn't have to drill hole. Having never seen an unfinished or stipped body tub, some members of OWF pointed out there is factor hole in the rearward side of the pillar - it can be accessed by removing the side panel behind the pillar. Its a bit of a PITA to get the side panels off given how the interior carpeting and padding was done. But once I knew there was an access hole back in there, it was worth tearing things up a bit. There is decorative plastic triangular cover to go over the top of the shoulder mount, but I kind of like the bare bracket look - plus with the tight fit against the window trim and the windlace etc, things work a bit better as is. I used a small spacer between the body and the shoulder belt mount to give clearance, and maybe I could use a bigger spacer, but I do want to ensure I get full thread engagement into the threaded backing plate (the mounting bolt isn't very long, and its a bit unique with a large shoulder that isn't going to be easily found in a longer length at the hardware store)
.



I installed lap belts years ago (thanks Jim - never had to test them out!), and there wasn't really any forward thought about 3pt belts at the time, so the lower retractor mount uses that floor hole I made for those previous belts- its not directly under the shoulder point, but it should be fine. I made a snazzy little bracket at the floor with dual mounts to handle both the retractor as well as the opposite end of the belt. It helped shift the retractor such that its pretty flush against the side wall, and also allows the terminal end of the belt to mount in such a way that the lap belt has no twist in it (sorry - that sort of stuff really annoys me). I bought my belts from wesco (instead of the similar seat belts plus), and the way the end of the belt was stitched onto the mounting eye, you can't mount the eye flat on the floor as the mounting eye is 'upside down' given the bend in the mounting eye (and I couldn't find a local shop that would touch restiching seat belts). So it really has to be mounted on a vertical plane - typically an L-bracket would suffice, but I didn't want to drill a second hole next to the retractor L-bracket - so I made a combo dual L-bracket (aka a 'U').

[Jim]

FINOCJ previously posted: